Comments on: The Civilization of Frogs http://scienceinmyfiction.com/2010/07/28/the-civilization-of-frogs/ "I like a little science in my fiction" Tue, 07 Feb 2012 12:31:56 -0500 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Felipe http://scienceinmyfiction.com/2010/07/28/the-civilization-of-frogs/comment-page-1/#comment-3396 Felipe Thu, 29 Jul 2010 10:54:38 +0000 http://crossedgenres.com/simf/?p=1121#comment-3396 haha loved the image! haha loved the image!

]]> By: Jo Thomas http://scienceinmyfiction.com/2010/07/28/the-civilization-of-frogs/comment-page-1/#comment-3360 Jo Thomas Wed, 28 Jul 2010 18:19:36 +0000 http://crossedgenres.com/simf/?p=1121#comment-3360 And then there's the stuff that's smart but (arguably) not proof of intelligence / civilisation. Most pet owners will admit that they've been trained by their pets at least as much as they have trained the animals. People who would argue that they have resisted this and that they are in charge have at least learnt the signals that the animal in question understands and are communicating with them in a manner more closely associated with their species than with humans. Did any of that make sense? And then there’s the stuff that’s smart but (arguably) not proof of intelligence / civilisation. Most pet owners will admit that they’ve been trained by their pets at least as much as they have trained the animals. People who would argue that they have resisted this and that they are in charge have at least learnt the signals that the animal in question understands and are communicating with them in a manner more closely associated with their species than with humans.

Did any of that make sense?

]]> By: bartleib http://scienceinmyfiction.com/2010/07/28/the-civilization-of-frogs/comment-page-1/#comment-3347 bartleib Wed, 28 Jul 2010 13:47:49 +0000 http://crossedgenres.com/simf/?p=1121#comment-3347 WHen humans help the intellectual development of another species (intentionally or not), it's called <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biological_uplift" rel="nofollow">biological uplift</a>. It's been used numerous times in SF, and there's no question that it's happening right now, albeit unintentionally. I kind of doubt that we as a species have the patience to do it on purpose. ;) WHen humans help the intellectual development of another species (intentionally or not), it’s called biological uplift. It’s been used numerous times in SF, and there’s no question that it’s happening right now, albeit unintentionally. I kind of doubt that we as a species have the patience to do it on purpose. ;)

]]> By: Carapace http://scienceinmyfiction.com/2010/07/28/the-civilization-of-frogs/comment-page-1/#comment-3346 Carapace Wed, 28 Jul 2010 13:31:54 +0000 http://crossedgenres.com/simf/?p=1121#comment-3346 For me, the problem with these sapience tests is that I don't think there is a single solid point at which a species is intelligent or self aware; it seems more like a spectrum. I can't think of anything we do that other species don't do as well *to some degree*. It's not as though humans just woke up one morning and had complicated language and space shuttles. There's a process, and I'm not sure where the tipping point between "clever animal" and "self aware person" really lies. But I think humans might actually be a driving force towards tool use and intelligence in other animals. This is something I'll have to flesh out more in my own time...thanks for making me think! For me, the problem with these sapience tests is that I don’t think there is a single solid point at which a species is intelligent or self aware; it seems more like a spectrum. I can’t think of anything we do that other species don’t do as well *to some degree*. It’s not as though humans just woke up one morning and had complicated language and space shuttles. There’s a process, and I’m not sure where the tipping point between “clever animal” and “self aware person” really lies.
But I think humans might actually be a driving force towards tool use and intelligence in other animals. This is something I’ll have to flesh out more in my own time…thanks for making me think!

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