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	<title>Comments on: Science, Symbolism, and Quantum Mechanics in SF</title>
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	<link>http://scienceinmyfiction.com/2010/03/04/science-symbolism-and-qm/</link>
	<description>&#34;I like a little science in my fiction&#34;</description>
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		<title>By: Casey Arend</title>
		<link>http://scienceinmyfiction.com/2010/03/04/science-symbolism-and-qm/comment-page-1/#comment-12959</link>
		<dc:creator>Casey Arend</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Jul 2011 14:24:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crossedgenres.com/simf/?p=269#comment-12959</guid>
		<description>Ron Paul is certainly probably my favorite person inside the forthcoming political election, however I do not sense such as he has been getting ample good videos from the one-sided mass media in order to tricot over the particular victory.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ron Paul is certainly probably my favorite person inside the forthcoming political election, however I do not sense such as he has been getting ample good videos from the one-sided mass media in order to tricot over the particular victory.</p>
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		<title>By: Gregory Benford</title>
		<link>http://scienceinmyfiction.com/2010/03/04/science-symbolism-and-qm/comment-page-1/#comment-2766</link>
		<dc:creator>Gregory Benford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jul 2010 05:36:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crossedgenres.com/simf/?p=269#comment-2766</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t see how TIMESCAPE rejects QM. Explain?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t see how TIMESCAPE rejects QM. Explain?</p>
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		<title>By: Quantum Mechanics</title>
		<link>http://scienceinmyfiction.com/2010/03/04/science-symbolism-and-qm/comment-page-1/#comment-766</link>
		<dc:creator>Quantum Mechanics</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Apr 2010 08:58:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crossedgenres.com/simf/?p=269#comment-766</guid>
		<description>The quantum mechanics seem to apply at small scales, nobody has seen evidence of them on a large scale, where outside influences can more easily destroy fragile quantum states.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The quantum mechanics seem to apply at small scales, nobody has seen evidence of them on a large scale, where outside influences can more easily destroy fragile quantum states.</p>
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		<title>By: Calvin Johnson</title>
		<link>http://scienceinmyfiction.com/2010/03/04/science-symbolism-and-qm/comment-page-1/#comment-284</link>
		<dc:creator>Calvin Johnson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Mar 2010 22:42:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crossedgenres.com/simf/?p=269#comment-284</guid>
		<description>Confession is good for the soul, Laura :)

As you know very well, SF is full of gadgets and shortcuts, and in recent years &quot;entanglement&quot; seems to have replaced &quot;sub-ether&quot; as a favorite fast communication gadget. It doesn&#039;t really upset me--but I am enough of a professor to point out that it won&#039;t work as advertised.

Something slightly more plausible--and I should have mentioned it in my main article-- would be using quantum devices as one-time communication gadgets. You can send messages one way, once, and then have to get a new one.  I&#039;m working on a series of stories using this, although none have sold yet....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Confession is good for the soul, Laura <img src='http://scienceinmyfiction.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>As you know very well, SF is full of gadgets and shortcuts, and in recent years &#8220;entanglement&#8221; seems to have replaced &#8220;sub-ether&#8221; as a favorite fast communication gadget. It doesn&#8217;t really upset me&#8211;but I am enough of a professor to point out that it won&#8217;t work as advertised.</p>
<p>Something slightly more plausible&#8211;and I should have mentioned it in my main article&#8211; would be using quantum devices as one-time communication gadgets. You can send messages one way, once, and then have to get a new one.  I&#8217;m working on a series of stories using this, although none have sold yet&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: LauraJMixon</title>
		<link>http://scienceinmyfiction.com/2010/03/04/science-symbolism-and-qm/comment-page-1/#comment-268</link>
		<dc:creator>LauraJMixon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Mar 2010 01:25:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crossedgenres.com/simf/?p=269#comment-268</guid>
		<description>Coming to the discussion belatedly... I confess that I have cheated on the science in several my books. With my proxies trilogy, I decided I wanted instantaneous communication, so I decided to ignore the science. 

It was a deliberate decision, for the sake of the story I wanted to tell, but I am enough of a hard SF proponent that it still makes me squirm a little. :-\</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Coming to the discussion belatedly&#8230; I confess that I have cheated on the science in several my books. With my proxies trilogy, I decided I wanted instantaneous communication, so I decided to ignore the science. </p>
<p>It was a deliberate decision, for the sake of the story I wanted to tell, but I am enough of a hard SF proponent that it still makes me squirm a little. :-\</p>
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		<title>By: Don&#8217;t know when I&#8217;ll be back again &#124; Crossed Genres</title>
		<link>http://scienceinmyfiction.com/2010/03/04/science-symbolism-and-qm/comment-page-1/#comment-178</link>
		<dc:creator>Don&#8217;t know when I&#8217;ll be back again &#124; Crossed Genres</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Mar 2010 03:26:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crossedgenres.com/simf/?p=269#comment-178</guid>
		<description>[...] up so far, which have spurred some great discussions &#8211; everything from dolphins-as-persons to quantum mechanics to the significance of water in spec-fic writing. Go take a read, and join the fun! Post title is [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] up so far, which have spurred some great discussions &#8211; everything from dolphins-as-persons to quantum mechanics to the significance of water in spec-fic writing. Go take a read, and join the fun! Post title is [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Calvin Johnson</title>
		<link>http://scienceinmyfiction.com/2010/03/04/science-symbolism-and-qm/comment-page-1/#comment-168</link>
		<dc:creator>Calvin Johnson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:20:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crossedgenres.com/simf/?p=269#comment-168</guid>
		<description>Suzy, in SF one can write down the words to justify pretty much anything; that&#039;s part of the fun. 

If orthodox quantum mechanics holds--and so far it has, spectacularly so--it is impossible to use entanglement to communicate. 

If one finds a way to use something like entanglement to communicate, then orthodox quantum mechanics *must* be, at some level, wrong. 

That&#039;s entirely *possible.*  By no means would I rule it out. Classical Newtonian mechanics is mostly right, but at some level it is wrong, and that wrong is relativity, and quantum mechanics. 

(If you were to ask me, do I think it likely to happen in the real world? I have to say no. Most of the time, when we discover new theories, they general restrict us and upset us, more than hand us magic. There are exceptions: lasers, and E = mc^2, and antibiotics for example. But look at how classical mechanics is wrong. Relativity tells us there is an ultimate speed limit. Quantum mechanics tells us the universe is fuzzy and random. My guess is that any theory that replaces quantum mechanics will only make us feel worse, not better.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Suzy, in SF one can write down the words to justify pretty much anything; that&#8217;s part of the fun. </p>
<p>If orthodox quantum mechanics holds&#8211;and so far it has, spectacularly so&#8211;it is impossible to use entanglement to communicate. </p>
<p>If one finds a way to use something like entanglement to communicate, then orthodox quantum mechanics *must* be, at some level, wrong. </p>
<p>That&#8217;s entirely *possible.*  By no means would I rule it out. Classical Newtonian mechanics is mostly right, but at some level it is wrong, and that wrong is relativity, and quantum mechanics. </p>
<p>(If you were to ask me, do I think it likely to happen in the real world? I have to say no. Most of the time, when we discover new theories, they general restrict us and upset us, more than hand us magic. There are exceptions: lasers, and E = mc^2, and antibiotics for example. But look at how classical mechanics is wrong. Relativity tells us there is an ultimate speed limit. Quantum mechanics tells us the universe is fuzzy and random. My guess is that any theory that replaces quantum mechanics will only make us feel worse, not better.)</p>
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		<title>By: Suzy</title>
		<link>http://scienceinmyfiction.com/2010/03/04/science-symbolism-and-qm/comment-page-1/#comment-166</link>
		<dc:creator>Suzy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Mar 2010 07:23:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crossedgenres.com/simf/?p=269#comment-166</guid>
		<description>I noticed quantum entanglement communications technology now appearing in some sci-fi novels (such as the Wess’Har Wars series by Karen Traviss, the Inheritance Trilogy by Ian Douglas). Others have acknowledged the problem with interacting, but give explanations of how to get around it - e.g. the EVE Online game has a &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.eveonline.com/background/communication/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Faster-than-Light Communication&lt;/a&gt; page, and the &lt;i&gt;Avatar&lt;/i&gt; movie guide had its own method:

&lt;i&gt;In recent decades, physicist Austin McKinney, a researcher at the Broadlawn Institute, discovered that by imposing an intense oscillating magnetic field on the first entangled particle, a tunneling effect occurred, and he could influence the state it would take when he measured it. This, in turn, instantly controlled the state of the other particle when it was measured, no matter how far away the particle happened to be.&lt;/i&gt;
&lt;i&gt;However, the tunneling process was far from perfect. The particle would adopt the desired state only once in ten thousand attempts. The other 9999 were random. But McKinney was undeterred. He developed a highly-redundant, error-correcting encoding scheme and was able to achieve a data transmission rate of 3 bits per hour.&lt;/i&gt;

So is it possible that physicists in the future will find a way to circumvent the breaking entanglement issue?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I noticed quantum entanglement communications technology now appearing in some sci-fi novels (such as the Wess’Har Wars series by Karen Traviss, the Inheritance Trilogy by Ian Douglas). Others have acknowledged the problem with interacting, but give explanations of how to get around it &#8211; e.g. the EVE Online game has a <a href="http://www.eveonline.com/background/communication/" rel="nofollow">Faster-than-Light Communication</a> page, and the <i>Avatar</i> movie guide had its own method:</p>
<p><i>In recent decades, physicist Austin McKinney, a researcher at the Broadlawn Institute, discovered that by imposing an intense oscillating magnetic field on the first entangled particle, a tunneling effect occurred, and he could influence the state it would take when he measured it. This, in turn, instantly controlled the state of the other particle when it was measured, no matter how far away the particle happened to be.</i><br />
<i>However, the tunneling process was far from perfect. The particle would adopt the desired state only once in ten thousand attempts. The other 9999 were random. But McKinney was undeterred. He developed a highly-redundant, error-correcting encoding scheme and was able to achieve a data transmission rate of 3 bits per hour.</i></p>
<p>So is it possible that physicists in the future will find a way to circumvent the breaking entanglement issue?</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan Wondrusch</title>
		<link>http://scienceinmyfiction.com/2010/03/04/science-symbolism-and-qm/comment-page-1/#comment-163</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan Wondrusch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Mar 2010 02:20:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crossedgenres.com/simf/?p=269#comment-163</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the explanation Calvin.  I&#039;d have to dust off the math skills quite a bit to dive into it, but I did make it through Calc at one point, so maybe not THAT far away.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the explanation Calvin.  I&#8217;d have to dust off the math skills quite a bit to dive into it, but I did make it through Calc at one point, so maybe not THAT far away.</p>
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		<title>By: Calvin Johnson</title>
		<link>http://scienceinmyfiction.com/2010/03/04/science-symbolism-and-qm/comment-page-1/#comment-154</link>
		<dc:creator>Calvin Johnson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Mar 2010 20:10:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crossedgenres.com/simf/?p=269#comment-154</guid>
		<description>Humans tend to conceptualize the world in terms of familiar experiences.  Unfortunately the microscopic world works very differently from our macroscopic one, and trying to &quot;explain&quot; quantum mechanics in terms of &quot;accessible&quot; metaphors often fail. I&#039;m not criticizing you for asking, mind, just noting the task is difficult. 

There are two problems--first, when one makes a crude metaphor for the microscopic world, it often is taken too concretely, and, second, there is a kind of exoticization of quantum mechanics which dwells on the metaphors; this is especially true when people try to tie it to some philosophical point, such as in Fritjof Capra&#039;s awful book &quot;The Tao of Physics.&quot;  So be aware that the metaphors are *just* metaphors. 

The way to really understand quantum mechanics is to learn it through mathematics; trying to describe quantum mechanics without math is like trying to describe a symphony to someone with cotton in their ears. 

I&#039;m a bad person to ask *because* I teach QM at a technical level; I don&#039;t read popularizations when I can avoid it, because they are, frankly, painful.

That said, I remember Gary Zhukov&#039;s &quot;The Dancing Wu Li Masters&quot; being less awful. Although superficially it looks like &quot;The Tao of Physics,&quot; Zhukov was careful to note that he was using metaphors to try to explain quantum mechanics--not using quantum mechanics to justify a particular philosophy. (It&#039;s not the philosophy I object to, but the bad use of metaphor.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Humans tend to conceptualize the world in terms of familiar experiences.  Unfortunately the microscopic world works very differently from our macroscopic one, and trying to &#8220;explain&#8221; quantum mechanics in terms of &#8220;accessible&#8221; metaphors often fail. I&#8217;m not criticizing you for asking, mind, just noting the task is difficult. </p>
<p>There are two problems&#8211;first, when one makes a crude metaphor for the microscopic world, it often is taken too concretely, and, second, there is a kind of exoticization of quantum mechanics which dwells on the metaphors; this is especially true when people try to tie it to some philosophical point, such as in Fritjof Capra&#8217;s awful book &#8220;The Tao of Physics.&#8221;  So be aware that the metaphors are *just* metaphors. </p>
<p>The way to really understand quantum mechanics is to learn it through mathematics; trying to describe quantum mechanics without math is like trying to describe a symphony to someone with cotton in their ears. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m a bad person to ask *because* I teach QM at a technical level; I don&#8217;t read popularizations when I can avoid it, because they are, frankly, painful.</p>
<p>That said, I remember Gary Zhukov&#8217;s &#8220;The Dancing Wu Li Masters&#8221; being less awful. Although superficially it looks like &#8220;The Tao of Physics,&#8221; Zhukov was careful to note that he was using metaphors to try to explain quantum mechanics&#8211;not using quantum mechanics to justify a particular philosophy. (It&#8217;s not the philosophy I object to, but the bad use of metaphor.)</p>
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